Discussion:
The Irony Of Bigots
(too old to reply)
Roedy Green
2005-01-14 20:13:05 UTC
Permalink
I find it peculiar that bigots, in the name of the prince of peace
spend most of their time attacking gay people.

Gays are the ones the army rejects as insufficiently bloodthirsty.

When was the last time you heard of a gay person beating up or
murdering someone?



"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Richard Dell
2005-01-14 21:23:05 UTC
Permalink
"Roedy Green" <look-***@mindprod.com.invalid> wrote in message news:***@4ax.com...

|I find it peculiar that bigots, in the name of the prince of peace
| spend most of their time attacking gay people.
|
| Gays are the ones the army rejects as insufficiently bloodthirsty.
|
| When was the last time you heard of a gay person beating up or
| murdering someone?

Not how I observe things. Bigots usually have one of more bogey men, who they
believe are responsible for everything they find wrong with the world. Jews,
Dubya, Blair, the USA, the Euro, the Royal Family, pinkos, the BNP, Muslims,
alien reptiles disguised as the Royal Ramily: yes - Gays: not really.
Server 13
2005-01-14 21:56:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Richard Dell
|I find it peculiar that bigots, in the name of the prince of peace
| spend most of their time attacking gay people.
|
| Gays are the ones the army rejects as insufficiently bloodthirsty.
|
| When was the last time you heard of a gay person beating up or
| murdering someone?
Not how I observe things. Bigots usually have one of more bogey men, who they
believe are responsible for everything they find wrong with the world.
Nope.

Jews,
Post by Richard Dell
Dubya, Blair, the USA, the Euro, the Royal Family, pinkos, the BNP, Muslims,
alien reptiles disguised as the Royal Ramily: yes - Gays: not really.
Bill Bonde ( ''The chamber was in confusion, all the voices shouting loud'' )
2005-01-14 21:36:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roedy Green
I find it peculiar that bigots, in the name of the prince of peace
spend most of their time attacking gay people.
Gays are the ones the army rejects as insufficiently bloodthirsty.
When was the last time you heard of a gay person beating up or
murdering someone?
A lot of the violent attacks on homosexuals are claimed to come from
closeted homosexuals, or at least that is what out in the open
homosexuals tend to claim on usenet. I expect they didn't realize what
they were saying when they made that claim.
--
Personally, I believe that 9/11 should have taught us the lesson that we
can't let these countries simmer endlessly in disillusionment without
doing something about it because people become susceptible to delusional
ideas and delusional actions. Iraq, in my view, is but the first of many
efforts, certainly not all military, to remake the very face of the
world as constitutional representative democracy.
Server 13
2005-01-14 21:57:01 UTC
Permalink
Bill Bonde ( ''The chamber was in confusion, all the voices shouting
Post by Bill Bonde ( ''The chamber was in confusion, all the voices shouting loud'' )
Post by Roedy Green
I find it peculiar that bigots, in the name of the prince of peace
spend most of their time attacking gay people.
Gays are the ones the army rejects as insufficiently bloodthirsty.
When was the last time you heard of a gay person beating up or
murdering someone?
A lot of the violent attacks on homosexuals are claimed to come from
closeted homosexuals, or at least that is what out in the open
homosexuals tend to claim on usenet.
Cite?


I expect they didn't realize what
Post by Bill Bonde ( ''The chamber was in confusion, all the voices shouting loud'' )
they were saying when they made that claim.
Bill Bonde ( ''The chamber was in confusion, all the voices shouting loud'' )
2005-01-14 23:08:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Server 13
Bill Bonde ( ''The chamber was in confusion, all the voices shouting
Post by Bill Bonde ( ''The chamber was in confusion, all the voices shouting loud'' )
Post by Roedy Green
I find it peculiar that bigots, in the name of the prince of peace
spend most of their time attacking gay people.
Gays are the ones the army rejects as insufficiently bloodthirsty.
When was the last time you heard of a gay person beating up or
murdering someone?
A lot of the violent attacks on homosexuals are claimed to come from
closeted homosexuals, or at least that is what out in the open
homosexuals tend to claim on usenet.
Cite?
A cite for what? I don't know if the monsters who murdered Matthew
Shepard were actually closeted homosexuals but that's certainly been
claimed.
Post by Server 13
I expect they didn't realize what
Post by Bill Bonde ( ''The chamber was in confusion, all the voices shouting loud'' )
they were saying when they made that claim.
--
Personally, I believe that 9/11 should have taught us the lesson that we
can't let these countries simmer endlessly in disillusionment without
doing something about it because people become susceptible to delusional
ideas and delusional actions. Iraq, in my view, is but the first of many
efforts, certainly not all military, to remake the very face of the
world as constitutional representative democracy.
Roedy Green
2005-01-14 23:10:45 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 13:36:39 -0800, "Bill Bonde ( ''The chamber was in
Post by Bill Bonde ( ''The chamber was in confusion, all the voices shouting loud'' )
A lot of the violent attacks on homosexuals are claimed to come from
closeted homosexuals, or at least that is what out in the open
homosexuals tend to claim on usenet. I expect they didn't realize what
they were saying when they made that claim.
The bashers are people who are not having gay sex. They are repressing
themselves. They are very emotional and very angry at gays who are
acting out their sexual desires. Sometimes bashers are just ordinary
bullies, and gays make as good a target as any.

Closeted usually means someone who has gay sex, but is very careful
not to let anyone find out about it. He is a chameleon. He may ACT as
if he were anti gay, but there is no emotion behind it.

http://mindprod.com/ggloss/closeted.html

"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Roedy Green
2005-01-14 23:33:08 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 23:10:45 GMT, Roedy Green
Post by Roedy Green
The bashers are people who are not having gay sex. They are repressing
themselves. They are very emotional and very angry at gays who are
acting out their sexual desires. Sometimes bashers are just ordinary
bullies, and gays make as good a target as any.
I used to fit in this category myself, though I did not actually bash
anyone. I had many fantasies about it though.

"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Bill Bonde ( ''The chamber was in confusion, all the voices shouting loud'' )
2005-01-15 00:46:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roedy Green
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 13:36:39 -0800, "Bill Bonde ( ''The chamber was in
Post by Bill Bonde ( ''The chamber was in confusion, all the voices shouting loud'' )
A lot of the violent attacks on homosexuals are claimed to come from
closeted homosexuals, or at least that is what out in the open
homosexuals tend to claim on usenet. I expect they didn't realize what
they were saying when they made that claim.
The bashers are people who are not having gay sex. They are repressing
themselves.
Don't you claim that you are celibate, not having gay sex?
Post by Roedy Green
They are very emotional and very angry at gays who are
acting out their sexual desires. Sometimes bashers are just ordinary
bullies, and gays make as good a target as any.
So that's your excuse for your attacks on Christians and Americans?
Post by Roedy Green
Closeted usually means someone who has gay sex, but is very careful
not to let anyone find out about it. He is a chameleon. He may ACT as
if he were anti gay, but there is no emotion behind it.
I'll have to wait until the next time some 'hate crime' occurs and you
comment.
--
Personally, I believe that 9/11 should have taught us the lesson that we
can't let these countries simmer endlessly in disillusionment without
doing something about it because people become susceptible to delusional
ideas and delusional actions. Iraq, in my view, is but the first of many
efforts, certainly not all military, to remake the very face of the
world as constitutional representative democracy.
Roedy Green
2005-01-15 23:54:00 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 16:46:17 -0800, "Bill Bonde ( ''The chamber was in
Post by Bill Bonde ( ''The chamber was in confusion, all the voices shouting loud'' )
Post by Roedy Green
The bashers are people who are not having gay sex. They are repressing
themselves.
Don't you claim that you are celibate, not having gay sex?
I don't see the connection. The reason I am celibate has nothing to do
with repression. It has to do with having no energy and being too
sick.




"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Richard Dell
2005-01-16 11:30:59 UTC
Permalink
"Roedy Green" <look-***@mindprod.com.invalid> wrote in message news:***@4ax.com...

| "Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
| Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
| nor of Mussolini."
| ~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
| on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.

Not sure why you use this as a footnote. Did you not think to wonder if Mr
Elkatmi had heard of the Armenian atrocity perpetrate by his own country in
1915? And "Turkish Human Rights" has the ring of an oxymoron over the last
millennium.
Roedy Green
2005-01-16 12:18:28 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 16 Jan 2005 11:30:59 -0000, "Richard Dell"
Post by Richard Dell
Not sure why you use this as a footnote. Did you not think to wonder if Mr
Elkatmi had heard of the Armenian atrocity perpetrate by his own country in
1915? And "Turkish Human Rights" has the ring of an oxymoron over the last
millennium.
I can't think of any country whose atrocities included rape by dog.
You Americans are over the top in kinkiness and cruelty.



"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Richard Dell
2005-01-16 16:16:04 UTC
Permalink
"Roedy Green" <look-***@mindprod.com.invalid> wrote in message news:***@4ax.com...

| On Sun, 16 Jan 2005 11:30:59 -0000, "Richard Dell"
| <***@hotmail.com> wrote or quoted :
|
| >Not sure why you use this as a footnote. Did you not think to wonder if Mr
| >Elkatmi had heard of the Armenian atrocity perpetrate by his own country in
| >1915? And "Turkish Human Rights" has the ring of an oxymoron over the last
| >millennium.
|
| I can't think of any country whose atrocities included rape by dog.

Translation: It is inconvienent to my prejudices to answer this question, so I
will throw in a spoiler.

| You Americans are over the top in kinkiness and cruelty.

Another spoiler. I am not American, and am not into such things.

The irony of this thread would seem to be lost on you.
Roedy Green
2005-01-18 08:59:08 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 16 Jan 2005 16:16:04 -0000, "Richard Dell"
Post by Richard Dell
| I can't think of any country whose atrocities included rape by dog.
Translation: It is inconvienent to my prejudices to answer this question, so I
will throw in a spoiler.
It is an answer. Americans have exceeded EVERYONE including Turks in
cruelty and depravity in their genocide. For example, what other
country ever dreamed anything so sick as using attack dogs to rape?



"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
E. Barry Bruyea
2005-01-18 14:57:48 UTC
Permalink
On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 08:59:08 GMT, Roedy Green
Post by Roedy Green
On Sun, 16 Jan 2005 16:16:04 -0000, "Richard Dell"
Post by Richard Dell
| I can't think of any country whose atrocities included rape by dog.
Translation: It is inconvienent to my prejudices to answer this question, so I
will throw in a spoiler.
It is an answer. Americans have exceeded EVERYONE including Turks in
cruelty and depravity in their genocide. For example, what other
country ever dreamed anything so sick as using attack dogs to rape?
There appears to be no limit to your hysterical, pathological hate of
the United States. Seek help, as in all the years in this medium I've
never seen anyone who needed it more. As to your constant 'Turkish'
reference, we all know (as do you) that it is a total and complete use
of hyperbole that deserves a mention in Guiness. It's a blatant lie,
period.
Post by Roedy Green
"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
Roedy Green
2005-01-19 01:08:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by E. Barry Bruyea
There appears to be no limit to your hysterical, pathological hate of
the United States.
Hatred of Hitler or Bush is rational. It is not like a hatred of
Muslims who harmed no one.
Post by E. Barry Bruyea
Seek help, as in all the years in this medium I've
never seen anyone who needed it more. As to your constant 'Turkish'
reference, we all know (as do you) that it is a total and complete use
of hyperbole that deserves a mention in Guiness. It's a blatant lie,
period.
And your evidence that it is a "lie" is only your say so. Not very
impressive.

Check out the Johns Hopkins study.
http://www.jhsph.edu/Refugee/Front%20Page%20News/Document%20Links/Mortality_Lancet%20final.pdf

There is no way you can weasel around the fact you killed 100,000
civilians. Read our own congressional record -- the questions
Gonzales is getting about Abu Ghraib. Stop putting your head in the
sand and pretending your live in Andy Griffith's USA. This is skinhead
country now.




"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Bullock
2005-01-20 09:20:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roedy Green
Post by E. Barry Bruyea
There appears to be no limit to your hysterical, pathological hate of
the United States.
Hatred of Hitler or Bush is rational. It is not like a hatred of
Muslims who harmed no one.
HUH ?????? Harmed *NO ONE* !!! Man... you are one sick fuck. They are
harming the whole fucking world with their sick ALLAH ALLAH ALLAH Jihad
bullshit.... They harm EVERY female within their own sick religion by virtue
of torture, repression and oppression. They harm the "Infidels" (any
NON-Muslim) by virtue of a written mandate to kill (and/or torture) each and
every one of them; that means ANY non-Muslim. Their entire belief system is
based on killing all those that don't conform to their sick barbaric heinous
"religion". You're lucky that you're living Canada; do you know what they do
to faggots??? But of course, you've kill filed me so can't read any of this,
OR anything else that disagrees with your sick warped MIND !!! You fucking
piece of shit.
Richard Dell
2005-01-20 12:22:04 UTC
Permalink
"Roedy Green" <look-***@mindprod.com.invalid> wrote in message news:***@4ax.com...

| Hatred of Hitler or Bush is rational. It is not like a hatred of
| Muslims who harmed no one.

Time for a history lesson. Islam is a litany of atrocities committed in the name
of Allah. A sample:

* From 712 in India, raiders commanded by Muhammad Qasim took three whole days
to slaughter the inhabitants of the city of Debal, and carried off their women
and children to slavery, some of it sexual.

* In the early eleventh century Mahmud of Ghazni, "passed through India like a
whirlwind, destroying, pillaging, and massacring," zealously following the
Koranic injunction to kill idolaters, whom he had vowed to chastise every year
of his life. In seventeen invasions Mahmud utterly ruined the prosperity of the
country, and the Hindus became like atoms of dust scattered in all directions.

* In 1400 Tamerlane devastated Georgia in and around Tifflis. In 1403, he
destroyed seven hundred towns, massacred the inhabitants, and razed to the
ground all the Christian churches of Tifflis.

* In 1402 Tamurlane and ordered Smyrna's entire population, including women and
children, annihilated, and the heads displayed in a pyramid.

* In 1571 Christians surrender Cyprus to Ottomans after being promised safety.
Troops freed but officers hacked to pieces and commander, after having his ears
cut off, was publicly flayed alive, his body stuffed with straw and put on show
in Constantinople.

* In India, Sikh Guru Tegh Bahadur along with his disciples was burned to death
by the Moghul ruler Aurangzeb in 1675. Another Sikh, Bhai Mati Das was sawn into
right and left halves while he was still alive.

* From 1843 to 1846 10,000 Assyrian Christians including women and children were
massacred by the Muslims.

* From 1894 to 1896 Abdul Hamid, Sultan of the Ottoman Empire, killed 150,000
Armenian Christians.

* From 1915 to 1918 750,000 Assyrians were killed in the name of Islamic Jihad.

* In 1933 thousands of Assyrian villagers were murdered by the Iraqi soldiers in
Northern Iraq.

* Since 1990 more than 10,000 Kashmiri Hindus have been brutally murdered by
Islamic fundamentalists.

* In July 1974, 4,000 Christians living in Cyprus were killed by Fahri Koroturk,
president of Turkey and his Islamic army.

* Over 30,000 Mauritanians have been killed by the Islamic dictators since 1960.

* 3,000,000 Bangladeshi Hindus Killed during the Pakistan-Bangladesh war in
1971.

* Over 40000 Lebanese Christians murdered by the PLO in the 1970s

* In 1976 Damour, Lebanon, children's eyes put out and limbs cut off by PLO.
123 people with no legs or arms. Many bodies dismembered, so had to be counted
by heads. Three men found with genitals cut off and stuffed in their mouths.

* Over 280,000 Ugandans killed during the reign of Idi Amin from 1971 to 1979.

* 1975 - 1999. East Timor. A third of the population - more than 250,000
people - were killed or allowed to die through starvation and disease.

* In 1980, 20,000 Syrians were murdered under the rule of Hafez Al-Assad,
President of Syria.

* Since 1992 120,000 Algerians have been murdered by the Islamic fundamentalist
army.

* Paksitan 2001. 17 Christians murdered in St. Dominic Church in Bahawalpur.

* East Timor 2001. After the independence referendum, Laksaur militia broke in
to a church, separated the men from the women and systematically murdered every
male.

* Beslan, Russia 2004. 300+ Teachers and schoolchildren raped and murdered by
Islamic militants.

* 1990 - 2005 Up to 2,000,000 black Muslims, Christians and animists displaced,
with hundreds of thousands murdered in Sudan by Muslim militias. Women's bones
broken so they could not escape repeated rapes.


Were you saying something about Crusaders or Jews? Oh, yes, it was your pet
hate, George Bush, and the 2,000,000 he personally murdered in Iraq.
Roedy Green
2005-01-21 08:52:53 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 20 Jan 2005 12:22:04 -0000, "Richard Dell"
Post by Richard Dell
| Hatred of Hitler or Bush is rational. It is not like a hatred of
| Muslims who harmed no one.
Time for a history lesson. Islam is a litany of atrocities committed in the name
Of course you could do the same thing for the history of European
Christians.

But that is no excuse for singling out your next door neighbour for
persecution. It is an insane racism.


Bush has kiddie porn anal rape videos made at Abu Ghraib.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/upi-breaking/20040717-082858-3675r.htm
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Richard Dell
2005-01-21 16:16:54 UTC
Permalink
"Roedy Green" <look-***@mindprod.com.invalid> wrote in message news:***@4ax.com...

| On Thu, 20 Jan 2005 12:22:04 -0000, "Richard Dell"
| <***@hotmail.com> wrote or quoted :
|
| >
| >| Hatred of Hitler or Bush is rational. It is not like a hatred of
| >| Muslims who harmed no one.
| >
| >Time for a history lesson. Islam is a litany of atrocities committed in the
name
| >of Allah. A sample:
|
| Of course you could do the same thing for the history of European
| Christians.

Let's hear it, then. I'm quite patient.

Did you notice that the worst was done under instruction from the Koran? Can you
find a Christian leader who killed everyone who wasn't Christian because the
Bible told him to?

| But that is no excuse for singling out your next door neighbour for
| persecution. It is an insane racism.

You mean, like this?

Azzam Pasha, Secretary-General of the Arab League said before the Arab attack:
"This will be a war of extermination and a momentous massacre which will be
spoken of like the Mongolian massacres and the Crusades."
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/History/1948_War.html

Thought better of your Turkish quote have you? Paederasty is it now?
Roedy Green
2005-01-22 06:18:24 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 21 Jan 2005 16:16:54 -0000, "Richard Dell"
Post by Richard Dell
Let's hear it, then. I'm quite patient.
To summarise briefly:

1. the crusades.

2. The non stop wars in Europe until 1900.

3. colonisation of the earth. The genocides in North America, Africa.
Forcing opium on China.

4. slavery.

5. WW I

6. WW II



Bush has kiddie porn anal rape videos made at Abu Ghraib.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/upi-breaking/20040717-082858-3675r.htm
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Richard Dell
2005-01-22 12:29:12 UTC
Permalink
"Roedy Green" <look-***@mindprod.com.invalid> wrote in message news:***@4ax.com...

| On Fri, 21 Jan 2005 16:16:54 -0000, "Richard Dell"
| <***@hotmail.com> wrote or quoted :
|
| >Let's hear it, then. I'm quite patient.
|
| To summarise briefly:
|
| 1. the crusades.

The First Crusade was a response to raids on Byzantine Christian trade by Muslim
bandits and pirates, in combination with the desire of Pope Urban to stop
Christians fighting amongst themselves by giving them the alternate goal of
liberating the "Holy Land". It is not and never was a fundamental tenet of
Christianity.They were actually modelled on the Muslim practice of Jihad,
without the
mandatory summary execution of all non-believers. The subsequent behaviour of
European knights and barons brought the Crusades into disrepute. Jihad is, and
always was, an obligation on *all* Muslims to fight in the cause of Islam until
the whole world is converted to it.

| 2. The non stop wars in Europe until 1900.

These were mostly political apart from the battles to repel Muslim aggression at
Vienna and Lepanto. Do you have a particular one in mind?

| 3. colonisation of the earth.

Economic and political. Britain actually took over the East India Company from
the Dutch. It was primarily about trade and while in today's moral climate the
imposition of British rule was wrong, it was benign and bears no comparison to
what the Muslims did, i.e. wanton destruction and wholesale murder. The Indian
economy thrived, and still benefits from the infrastructure and legal systems
left by the British.

| The genocides in North America, Africa.

I cannot defend what amounts to ethnic cleansing in the USA. I do not know what
you mean about Africa, which has always been riddled with tribal conflict, much
of which was stopped by Europeans.

| Forcing opium on China.

True, but economic.

| 4. slavery.

Borrowed from Muslims. In fact most slaves used by Christians were bought from
Muslims. Britain stopped slavery in the early nineteenth century, the USA in the
mid nineteenth century, Saudi Arabia in 1963, and Sudan still practices it.
<http://groups.google.co.uk/groups?q=Re:+Why+didn%27t+Islam+abolish+salvery+%3F&hl=en&lr=&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official_s&selm=41E9DC11.775B0E4A%40io.com&rnum=1>

| 5. WW I

Political

| 6. WW II

Nazis were not Christians. In fact the only body that Hitler feared could
seriously oppose him was the Church. As it happened, the Pope of the time
was religiously pious, but quite unworldly and politically naive, and
offered no resistance to the rise of Nazism. Many Priests went to their
deaths in concentration camps for being considered a possible or real threat
to the Nazis.

From a Hitler youth marching song:

We follow not Christ, but Horst Wessel,
Away with incense and Holy Water,
The Church can go hang for all we care,
The Swastika brings salvation on Earth.

On arrival at Auschwitz, new arrivals were greeted with "This is Auschwitz, you
will die here - within three months; if you are a priest, within one month; if a
Jew, within one week."

...

So none of your criticisms apply to any act done in the name of Christianity or
with reference to or justification from the Bible. Some were defensive and quite
justifiable. Others were the weaknesses of men, not of their faith.

None of these detract from the point that Muslims have been very bad conquerors
and and your intemperate remark that provoked it: "Hatred of Hitler or Bush is
rational. It is not like a hatred of Muslims who harmed no one."

You left out the worst and perhaps only valid target, i.e. Torquemada and his
Inquisition, itself partly intended to rid Spain of its remaining Muslim
opressors and deriving from their methods. I would stop shooting from the hip
and study some history.

| Bush has kiddie porn anal rape videos made at Abu Ghraib.
| http://www.washingtontimes.com/upi-breaking/20040717-082858-3675r.htm

Grow up.
Roedy Green
2005-01-23 00:34:49 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 22 Jan 2005 12:29:12 -0000, "Richard Dell"
Post by Richard Dell
The First Crusade was a response to raids on Byzantine Christian trade by Muslim
bandits and pirates, in combination with the desire of Pope Urban to stop
Christians fighting amongst themselves by giving them the alternate goal of
liberating the "Holy Land". It is not and never was a fundamental tenet of
Christianity.They were actually modelled on the Muslim practice of Jihad,
without the
mandatory summary execution of all non-believers. The subsequent behaviour of
European knights and barons brought the Crusades into disrepute. Jihad is, and
always was, an obligation on *all* Muslims to fight in the cause of Islam until
the whole world is converted to it.
This is no the story I read. Do you have a special KKK illustrated
history?


Bush has kiddie porn anal rape videos made at Abu Ghraib.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/upi-breaking/20040717-082858-3675r.htm
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Richard Dell
2005-01-23 18:01:49 UTC
Permalink
"Roedy Green" <look-***@mindprod.com.invalid> wrote in message news:***@4ax.com...
| On Sat, 22 Jan 2005 12:29:12 -0000, "Richard Dell"
| <***@hotmail.com> wrote or quoted :

| >The First Crusade was a response to raids on Byzantine Christian trade by
Muslim
| >bandits and pirates, in combination with the desire of Pope Urban to stop
| >Christians fighting amongst themselves by giving them the alternate goal of
| >liberating the "Holy Land". It is not and never was a fundamental tenet of
| >Christianity.They were actually modelled on the Muslim practice of Jihad,
| >without the
| >mandatory summary execution of all non-believers. The subsequent behaviour of
| >European knights and barons brought the Crusades into disrepute. Jihad is,
and
| >always was, an obligation on *all* Muslims to fight in the cause of Islam
until
| >the whole world is converted to it.

| This is no [sic] the story I read.

You can read? Perhaps you should try and look at sites that deal with facts
rather than your favourite conspiracy theories.
http://atheism.about.com/od/crusades/a/crusades_3.htm

| Do you have a special KKK illustrated history?

This snide remark is in liew of a proper response, is it?

No answers to all the other points, I see. Too busy searching for more dirt on
Bush, no doubt.

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so
certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts."
- Bertrand Russell (1872-1970)

E. Barry Bruyea
2005-01-20 21:15:41 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 01:08:19 GMT, Roedy Green
Post by Roedy Green
Post by E. Barry Bruyea
There appears to be no limit to your hysterical, pathological hate of
the United States.
Hatred of Hitler or Bush is rational. It is not like a hatred of
Muslims who harmed no one.
Hatred is one thing, Roedy, as is political dissent, but your approach
is to blame (and lie doing it) the Americans for everything since the
Great Flood. You are simply not rational; not even close, as your
'Turkish' tag line proves every time you post it.
Post by Roedy Green
Post by E. Barry Bruyea
Seek help, as in all the years in this medium I've
never seen anyone who needed it more. As to your constant 'Turkish'
reference, we all know (as do you) that it is a total and complete use
of hyperbole that deserves a mention in Guiness. It's a blatant lie,
period.
And your evidence that it is a "lie" is only your say so. Not very
impressive.
Check out the Johns Hopkins study.
http://www.jhsph.edu/Refugee/Front%20Page%20News/Document%20Links/Mortality_Lancet%20final.pdf
There is no way you can weasel around the fact you killed 100,000
civilians. Read our own congressional record -- the questions
Gonzales is getting about Abu Ghraib. Stop putting your head in the
sand and pretending your live in Andy Griffith's USA. This is skinhead
country now.
"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
Roedy Green
2005-01-21 08:54:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by E. Barry Bruyea
Hatred is one thing, Roedy, as is political dissent, but your approach
is to blame (and lie doing it) the Americans for everything since the
Great Flood. You are simply not rational; not even close, as your
'Turkish' tag line proves every time you post it.
I did not blame them for the great flood. Anything I have blamed them
for, I will back up. Be specific.

They are busybody country meddling like no other in modern times. So
of course they rack up a lot of blame.


Bush has kiddie porn anal rape videos made at Abu Ghraib.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/upi-breaking/20040717-082858-3675r.htm
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Bill Bonde ( ''The chamber was in confusion, all the voices shouting loud'' )
2005-01-17 02:54:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Richard Dell
| "Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
| Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
| nor of Mussolini."
| ~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
| on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
Not sure why you use this as a footnote. Did you not think to wonder if Mr
Elkatmi had heard of the Armenian atrocity perpetrate by his own country in
1915? And "Turkish Human Rights" has the ring of an oxymoron over the last
millennium.
Joey, have you ever been in a Turkish prison?
--
Personally, I believe that 9/11 should have taught us the lesson that we
can't let these countries simmer endlessly in disillusionment without
doing something about it because people become susceptible to delusional
ideas and delusional actions. Iraq, in my view, is but the first of many
efforts, certainly not all military, to remake the very face of the
world as constitutional representative democracy.
Roedy Green
2005-01-15 23:55:38 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 16:46:17 -0800, "Bill Bonde ( ''The chamber was in
Post by Bill Bonde ( ''The chamber was in confusion, all the voices shouting loud'' )
So that's your excuse for your attacks on Christians and Americans?
My attacks on Christian are for:

1. promoting violence against gays

2. hypocrisy

3. spreading superstition.

4. lying.


My attacks against Americans are for:

1. international bullying and violence.

2. exploiting the third world

3. hypocrisy

4. vanity



"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Haximus
2005-01-14 22:30:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roedy Green
I find it peculiar that bigots, in the name of the prince of peace
spend most of their time attacking gay people.
Gays are the ones the army rejects as insufficiently bloodthirsty.
When was the last time you heard of a gay person beating up or
murdering someone?
Gays are victims of messed-up biologics, too much estrogen and not
enough testosterone makesthem feminized and passive.

I bet if the army fixed up those boys with a little testosterone
therapy, they'd be more than rarin' to kill.
Roedy Green
2005-01-14 23:13:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Haximus
Gays are victims of messed-up biologics, too much estrogen and not
enough testosterone makesthem feminized and passive.
I have had my testosterone measured. It is normal. I am anything but
feminised, and you can see from my constant ragging of you guys, I am
not passive.



"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Walker
2005-01-14 23:40:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roedy Green
Post by Haximus
Gays are victims of messed-up biologics, too much estrogen and not
enough testosterone makesthem feminized and passive.
I have had my testosterone measured. It is normal. I am anything but
feminised, and you can see from my constant ragging of you guys, I am
not passive.
"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
Too much testosterone through steroid abuse makes the balls shrink, the tits
grow and the aggressiveness fly through the roof!

Otherwise, you become a female bitch!
Haximus
2005-01-14 23:56:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roedy Green
Post by Haximus
Gays are victims of messed-up biologics, too much estrogen and not
enough testosterone makesthem feminized and passive.
I have had my testosterone measured. It is normal. I am anything but
feminised, and you can see from my constant ragging of you guys, I am
not passive.
Let me tell you a little story. I had a former school friend who I knew
from the age of six, we were terrific pals, at about puberty he started
exhibiting some rather "effeminate" behaviour. It took a couple of
years, you know, being just kids and all and not really understanding
what being "gay" meant, but eventually we realized he was gay... and he
realized he was gay. His parents didn't really seem to notice and he
tried to keep it in the closet for the longest time, was always making
up stories about fictitious girlfriends that we'd never meet, etc. One
day he made a pass at me, I remember punching him out pretty good...
that was just my natural reaction. On the gay TV sitcoms that never
seems to happen (I guess it wouldn't be funny). We stayed friends but
didn't socialize much after that and eventually lost contact after
high-school. I heard he'd moved to Vancouver, that his folks finally
clued-in about his gayness, and that he was living as a "transvestite"
while waiting for "gender reassignment" surgey. I was pretty shocked.
Then a couple of years later I saw his (I mean her) photo in a newspaper
article, "she" was murdered while working as a transgender prostitute.
Sad story, his folks had a terrible time accepting the whole thing,
blamed themselves. The mother in particular, was convinced it was
because she smoked heavily while pregnant, though it did something to
screw up his hormones.
Roedy Green
2005-01-16 00:23:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Haximus
We stayed friends but
didn't socialize much after that and eventually lost contact after
high-school. I heard he'd moved to Vancouver, that his folks finally
clued-in about his gayness, and that he was living as a "transvestite"
while waiting for "gender reassignment" surgey.
You need to understand the definitions of transsexual, transvestite
and gay.

They are three quite different things, often deliberately confused by
bigots.

See http://mindprod.com/ggloss/gay.html

http://mindprod.com/ggloss/transsexual.html

http://mindprod.com/ggloss/transvestite.html



"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Haximus
2005-01-16 02:26:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roedy Green
On Fri, 14 Jan 2
You need to understand the definitions of transsexual, transvestite
and gay.
Oh please...

Have you ever raised chickens? I've seen chickens exhibit some strange
behaviour, if one of them gets injured or appears to have something
wrong with it, the other birds will literally peck it to death.

I've seen it happen several times, a dog will somehow get into a pen and
maul a bird, if caught in time the bird will usually be okay except for
a little bloody and missing a few feathers.

The next morning, feeding time, there's the bird dead on the floor with
all the feathers on it's back missing, dead from heat loss and shock,
because the other chickens spent the night pecking it to death.

I suppose it has something to do with self-preservation in the wild,
weak members of the flock potentially attract predators, so the natural
instinct of chickens is to eliminate those threats.

Humans seem to exhibit similar behaviour towards members of it's own
species, members that appear sick, different, or threaten the survivial
of the species. That would explain why some men are aggresive and
violent towards gays, it's a natural animal instinct to weed out the bad
eggs that threaten the survival of the species.

Of course we are sentient beings, which are supposedly a little smarter
than chickens, but those animal instincts are still part of us and still
direct our actions.
Roedy Green
2005-01-16 02:43:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Haximus
Post by Roedy Green
You need to understand the definitions of transsexual, transvestite
and gay.
Oh please...
Have you ever raised chickens?
What on earth has the pecking order of chickens got to do with your
muddling of homosexuality, transsexualism, and transvestism?

That has to be the mother of all non-sequiturs.


"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Haximus
2005-01-16 02:54:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roedy Green
Post by Haximus
Post by Roedy Green
You need to understand the definitions of transsexual, transvestite
and gay.
Oh please...
Have you ever raised chickens?
What on earth has the pecking order of chickens got to do with your
muddling of homosexuality, transsexualism, and transvestism?
That has to be the mother of all non-sequiturs.
Directly applicable to the topic of violence and gays, but you appear
incapable of abstract thought. I'm sure more capable people understood
the connection, I'm sorry you didn't.
Roedy Green
2005-01-16 05:29:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Haximus
Directly applicable to the topic of violence and gays, but you appear
incapable of abstract thought. I'm sure more capable people understood
the connection, I'm sorry you didn't.
How about some hints.

Are you suggesting that because chickens kill each other that is
natural and ok for you to go gay bashing?

That makes about as much sense as me using the dietary habits of
crocodiles to justify decapitating you.


"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Haximus
2005-01-16 06:55:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roedy Green
Post by Haximus
Directly applicable to the topic of violence and gays, but you appear
incapable of abstract thought. I'm sure more capable people understood
the connection, I'm sorry you didn't.
How about some hints.
Are you suggesting that because chickens kill each other that is
natural and ok for you to go gay bashing?
That makes about as much sense as me using the dietary habits of
crocodiles to justify decapitating you.
As an amature student of animal behaviour I threw that out just to see
how you would react, and as I guessed, it made you very defensive. Why?
I'm only tossing around an idea, if you think it amounts to gay
bashing then I'm sorry you take it that way. On the contrary, I was
trying to hash out an idea as to why men attack gays, based on my own
personal animal behaviour observations.

Doesn't it make you wonder why, that animals of the same species will
kill their own weak and injured? When I saw this happen, I wondered why
the heck they do it... why would they deliberately cull a sick member
from their group? I surmise that it is because they instinctively know
a sick animal is a threat to the survival of the group, and that it can
attract predators and disease.

Of course my theorizing would make you uncomfortable, in your mind I am
implying that you are the sick animal in the group... but I'm simply
communicating a theory.

So why do some men attack gays? Perhaps it's just plain old Darwinism,
the health of a species is maintained by natural selection, by the
culling of the weak and diseased. I know it's a terrible thing for gays
with what this implies.... but that Darwin was right about a lot of things.
Bill
2005-01-14 22:24:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roedy Green
I find it peculiar that bigots, in the name of the prince of peace
spend most of their time attacking gay people.
Sorry but that's a load of SHIT.

ANYBODY that disagrees with the gay agenda is a bigot. Ask any Gay! He'll tell
you so!
Post by Roedy Green
Gays are the ones the army rejects as insufficiently bloodthirsty.
When was the last time you heard of a gay person beating up or
murdering someone?
"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Roedy Green
2005-01-14 23:12:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bill
ANYBODY that disagrees with the gay agenda is a bigot.
The gay agenda is:

1. we don't want to be beat up.

2. we want to be treated the same as others in employment and housing.

3. we want to have the same civil rights as others.

If you don't agree with this, you don't believe in equality. By
definition, you are a bigot.



"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Bill
2005-01-14 23:52:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roedy Green
Post by Bill
ANYBODY that disagrees with the gay agenda is a bigot.
1. we don't want to be beat up.
2. we want to be treated the same as others in employment and housing.
3. we want to have the same civil rights as others.
If you don't agree with this, you don't believe in equality. By
definition, you are a bigot.
I don't think that anyone wants to beat you up.

I do not see where you are being treated any different then others in employment
and housing.

I think you have the same civil rights as others.

The thing is, that I don't think that what you have
listed is the true gay agenda. I think it's window dressing.

The main thing that you want is "accepted in society" To do that
you have to convert a lot of people to your way of life. Either that
or brainwash enough into thinking ab-normal behavior is normal
behavior.

I think that you first want to try to meld into "society" through
bastardizing the meaning of traditional marriage.
Paul R
2005-01-15 00:33:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bill
Post by Roedy Green
Post by Bill
ANYBODY that disagrees with the gay agenda is a bigot.
1. we don't want to be beat up.
2. we want to be treated the same as others in employment and housing.
3. we want to have the same civil rights as others.
The thing is, that I don't think that what you have
listed is the true gay agenda. I think it's window dressing.
The main thing that you want is "accepted in society" To do that
you have to convert a lot of people to your way of life. Either that
or brainwash enough into thinking ab-normal behavior is normal
behavior.
I think that you first want to try to meld into "society" through
bastardizing the meaning of traditional marriage.
WTF!!! What a sad, ignorant man you are. Gays, lesbians, transgendered, etc.
are already accepted by most of society.

Amongst my friends, family and colleagues gays and straights mix socially
all the time. Our extended family includes the daughter of a lesbian couple
(a second is on the way!) who is loved and cared for by all in the family,
including the great-grandparents. No one feels "converted", or
"brainwashed". No one is threatened in any way.

One of the great things about living in a large city (Toronto) is that you
can meet people from all different cultures and, more importantly, learn how
vastly different people can be, yet still the same in the most important
ways. We all need to love. We all need family. We all need a purpose in
life. Gays and lesbians aren't normal or ab-normal, they are part of all of
us, the family of man. As such, they deserve to be allowed to marry.

That's what I think,
Paul
Bill
2005-01-15 00:39:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Paul R
Post by Bill
Post by Roedy Green
Post by Bill
ANYBODY that disagrees with the gay agenda is a bigot.
1. we don't want to be beat up.
2. we want to be treated the same as others in employment and housing.
3. we want to have the same civil rights as others.
The thing is, that I don't think that what you have
listed is the true gay agenda. I think it's window dressing.
The main thing that you want is "accepted in society" To do that
you have to convert a lot of people to your way of life. Either that
or brainwash enough into thinking ab-normal behavior is normal
behavior.
I think that you first want to try to meld into "society" through
bastardizing the meaning of traditional marriage.
WTF!!! What a sad, ignorant man you are.
Names names names You always resort to calling names. Names do not change the
truth.
Post by Paul R
Gays, lesbians, transgendered, etc.
are already accepted by most of society.
Mainly in large cities where they have the numbers to create their own kind of
society but not in real society.
Post by Paul R
Amongst my friends, family and colleagues gays and straights mix socially
all the time. Our extended family includes the daughter of a lesbian couple
(a second is on the way!) who is loved and cared for by all in the family,
including the great-grandparents. No one feels "converted", or
"brainwashed". No one is threatened in any way.
It's obvious that you've been converted or brainwashed into thinking that
buggery is fine.
Post by Paul R
One of the great things about living in a large city (Toronto)
You just made my case for me.
Post by Paul R
is that you
can meet people from all different cultures and, more importantly, learn how
vastly different people can be, yet still the same in the most important
ways. We all need to love. We all need family. We all need a purpose in
life. Gays and lesbians aren't normal or ab-normal, they are part of all of
us, the family of man.
That's just your opinion. Mine is different and if you disagree with ME then you
Post by Paul R
As such, they deserve to be allowed to marry.
Gays cannot be married because marriage is between a man and a woman. They can
be an infinite number of other things, they just cannot be married. I am sorry
but that's what marriage is.
Post by Paul R
That's what I think,
Paul
Not a bad rebuttal but it would be a lot better if you left the name calling
out.

That's what I think,
Paul R
2005-01-15 03:08:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bill
Post by Paul R
Post by Roedy Green
Post by Bill
ANYBODY that disagrees with the gay agenda is a bigot.
1. we don't want to be beat up.
2. we want to be treated the same as others in employment and housing.
3. we want to have the same civil rights as others.
Amongst my friends, family and colleagues gays and straights mix socially
all the time. Our extended family includes the daughter of a lesbian couple
(a second is on the way!) who is loved and cared for by all in the family,
including the great-grandparents. No one feels "converted", or
"brainwashed". No one is threatened in any way.
It's obvious that you've been converted or brainwashed into thinking that
buggery is fine.
Are you calling my family brainwashed? Because we treat each other, and our
children, with love and mutual respect?

And you object to my calling you ignorant? Look into the mirror.
Post by Bill
Not a bad rebuttal but it would be a lot better if you left the name calling
out.
Bill
2005-01-15 03:17:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roedy Green
Post by Bill
Post by Paul R
Post by Roedy Green
Post by Bill
ANYBODY that disagrees with the gay agenda is a bigot.
1. we don't want to be beat up.
2. we want to be treated the same as others in employment and
housing.
Post by Bill
Post by Paul R
Post by Roedy Green
3. we want to have the same civil rights as others.
Amongst my friends, family and colleagues gays and straights mix
socially
Post by Bill
Post by Paul R
all the time. Our extended family includes the daughter of a lesbian
couple
Post by Bill
Post by Paul R
(a second is on the way!) who is loved and cared for by all in the
family,
Post by Bill
Post by Paul R
including the great-grandparents. No one feels "converted", or
"brainwashed". No one is threatened in any way.
It's obvious that you've been converted or brainwashed into thinking that
buggery is fine.
Are you calling my family brainwashed? Because we treat each other, and our
children, with love and mutual respect?
I didn't say anything about your family. Do you think your family is
brainwashed?

Why did you bring them into this thread?
Post by Roedy Green
And you object to my calling you ignorant? Look into the mirror.
I didn't object to you making a fool of yourself by calling me names.
Help yourself if it makes you feel better. I just said it would be a lot
better rebuttal if you left the name calling out.
Post by Roedy Green
Post by Bill
Not a bad rebuttal but it would be a lot better if you left the name
calling
Post by Bill
out.
Roedy Green
2005-01-16 00:00:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bill
It's obvious that you've been converted or brainwashed into thinking that
buggery is fine.
Why is that any of your business?

It does not concern you.

And just what do you expect gay people do to satisfy your majesty,
queen of the universe, guardian of public morality?




"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Bill
2005-01-16 01:44:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roedy Green
Post by Bill
It's obvious that you've been converted or brainwashed into thinking that
buggery is fine.
Why is that any of your business?
It is against the law. &
It spread AIDS all over the world!
Post by Roedy Green
It does not concern you.
And just what do you expect gay people do to satisfy your majesty,
queen of the universe, guardian of public morality?
"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Roedy Green
2005-01-16 02:42:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bill
Post by Roedy Green
Why is that any of your business?
It is against the law. &
It spread AIDS all over the world!
It has no business being against the law, any more the heterosexual
bum fucking does, or oral sex, or making silly faces in the mirror
when brushing your teeth. It is a private matter that has no effect on
anyone else. In Canada, our Prime Minister Pierre Trudeau put it
succinctly, "There's no place for the state in the bedrooms of the
nation." He went on to say "what's done in private between adults
doesn't concern the Criminal Code."

You fail to notice that by far the most cases in the world were
transmitted heterosexually. You also fail to acknowledge that
straight female teens in the USA are the fastest growing group of HIV+
people.

Promiscuity passes HIV, not homosexuality. Monogamous gay couples are
completely safe.

You Mr. bigot want to ban gay marriages to INCREASE promiscuity and
thus help the spread of AIDS.

Your true agenda is the same as Reagan's, increase the spread of AIDS
in an attempt to permanently wipe all gay people off the planet,
forgetting of course, they are born of heterosexual parents.




"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Bill
2005-01-16 04:56:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roedy Green
Post by Bill
Post by Roedy Green
Why is that any of your business?
It is against the law. &
It spread AIDS all over the world!
It has no business being against the law, any more the heterosexual
bum fucking does, or oral sex,
It is an illegal act. It always was and it should always continue to be.
This is not an issue of making funny faces, it's buggery.
Post by Roedy Green
or making silly faces in the mirror
when brushing your teeth. It is a private matter that has no effect on
anyone else. In Canada, our Prime Minister Pierre Trudeau put it
succinctly, "There's no place for the state in the bedrooms of the
nation." He went on to say "what's done in private between adults
doesn't concern the Criminal Code."
You fail to notice that by far the most cases in the world were transmitted
heterosexually
Sure, after the homos spread it all over the world.

It was the 1 % of our homo population that spread the HIV into the 99%
heterosexual population.

Don't you remember back to about 1985 when people began to realize that the
homos were spreading the HIV decease into the heterosexual population. Before
that all people had to worry about was herpes or the clap.
Post by Roedy Green
You also fail to acknowledge that
straight female teens in the USA are the fastest growing group of HIV+
people.
Well had the homosexuals not gone around spreading HIV everywhere they went,
like someone running around starting fires in the grass on a hot windy day, then
the decease might well have been contained, or at least delayed until more was
known about it.
Post by Roedy Green
Promiscuity passes HIV, not homosexuality. Monogamous gay couples are
completely safe.
You Mr. bigot want to ban gay marriages to INCREASE promiscuity and
thus help the spread of AIDS.
Your true agenda is the same as Reagan's, increase the spread of AIDS
in an attempt to permanently wipe all gay people off the planet,
forgetting of course, they are born of heterosexual parents.
"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Roedy Green
2005-01-16 07:04:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bill
It is an illegal act. It always was and it should always continue to be.
This is not an issue of making funny faces, it's buggery.
The supreme court in 2003 overturned Texas's anti-sodomy law. That
means every other such law is now dead, as soon as it is challenged.

So for all practical purposes that era of meddling in gay lives in
over.


"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Tom the Canuck
2005-01-16 03:46:38 UTC
Permalink
Against the law??? Where? You'd probably do it if you didn't have a pole up
your fat ass.
Post by Bill
Post by Roedy Green
Post by Bill
It's obvious that you've been converted or brainwashed into thinking that
buggery is fine.
Why is that any of your business?
It is against the law. &
It spread AIDS all over the world!
Post by Roedy Green
It does not concern you.
And just what do you expect gay people do to satisfy your majesty,
queen of the universe, guardian of public morality?
"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Bill
2005-01-16 04:58:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tom the Canuck
Against the law??? Where? You'd probably do it if you didn't have a pole up
your fat ass.
It's called buggery and yes it is an illegal act.
Post by Tom the Canuck
Post by Bill
Post by Roedy Green
Post by Bill
It's obvious that you've been converted or brainwashed into thinking
that
Post by Bill
Post by Roedy Green
Post by Bill
buggery is fine.
Why is that any of your business?
It is against the law. &
It spread AIDS all over the world!
Post by Roedy Green
It does not concern you.
And just what do you expect gay people do to satisfy your majesty,
queen of the universe, guardian of public morality?
"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Roedy Green
2005-01-16 05:27:52 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 15 Jan 2005 21:46:38 -0600, "Tom the Canuck"
Post by Tom the Canuck
Against the law??? Where? You'd probably do it if you didn't have a pole up
your fat ass.
On 2003-11-18, the supreme court struck down the Texas anti-sodomy
law, so presumably any other states' would similarly crumble if
challenged.

http://www.cnn.com/2003/LAW/06/26/scotus.sodomy/



"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Bill
2005-01-16 05:39:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tom the Canuck
Against the law??? Where? You'd probably do it if you didn't have a pole up
your fat ass.
Post by Bill
Post by Roedy Green
Post by Bill
It's obvious that you've been converted or brainwashed into thinking
that
Post by Bill
Post by Roedy Green
Post by Bill
buggery is fine.
Why is that any of your business?
It is against the law. &
It spread AIDS all over the world!
You are right, It's not against the law anymore. IE:


PROVINCE/TERRITORY LAWS

No province or territory has sodomy laws.

All province and territory ages of sexual consent are 14 for oral sex, and 18
for anal sex.
*************************************************
So Homos can legally go around blowing boys of 14 and get it up their ass at 18.

That's real progress!

When you are blowing and buggering boys in the US make sure you know what state
you do it in




United States Anti-"Sodomy" Laws (as of 12/1/95), state by state In the first
column, an M indicates misdemeanor, F is felony.

This page got created some years before the US Supreme Court struck down
anti-sodomy laws throughout the United States. The ACLU has a lot more
information on this at:

http://www.aclu.org/issues/gay/sodomy.html

for more up-to-date listings.

ALABAMA
M 13A-6-65,Sexual Misconduct, 1 year/$2000 Does not apply to married couples.

ALASKA
Repealed effective 1980

ARIZONA
M 13-1411, Crime Against Nature (anal intercourse), 30 days/$500. M 13-1412,
Lewd and Lascivious Acts, 30 days/$500

ARKANSAS
M 5-14-111, Sodomy, 1 year/$1000, same sex only. Bill passed unanimously "aimed
at weirdos and queers who live in a fairyland world and are trying to wreck
family life." Signed into law by governor in 1977.

CALIFORNIA
Repealed effective 1976

COLORADO
Repealed effective 1972

CONNECTICUT
Repealed effective 1971

DELAWARE
Repealed effective 1973

FLORIDA
M 800.02, Unnatural and Lascivious Act, 60 days/$500

GEORGIA
F 16-6-2, Sodomy, 1 to 20 years. Upheld as to homosexuals on the grounds that
there is no fundamental federal constitutional right to "engage in sodomy."
Bowers v. Hardwick, 478 U.S. 186 (1986). M 16-6-15, Solicitation of Sodomy, 1
year/$1000

HAWAII
Repealed effective 1973

IDAHO
F 18-6605, Crime Against Nature, 5 years to life

ILLINOIS
Repealed effective 1962. First state to repeal sodomy laws, in 1961.

INDIANA
Repealed effective 1977. Earlier effort to repeal said legalization might "give
us an opportunity to study it more openly, and to see what causes it, in the
hope that we can eventually eliminate it."

IOWA
Repealed effective 1978

KANSAS
M 21-3505, Sodomy, 6 months/$1000, same sex only

KENTUCKY
Held unconstitutional by state Supreme Court 1992. Commonwealth v. Wasson

LOUISIANNA
F 14.89, Crime Against Nature, 5 years/$2000. Held unconstitutional by Orleans
Parish Court, appeal pending.

MAINE
Repealed effective 1976

MARYLAND
F 27-553, Sodomy, 10 years. F 27-554, Unnatural or Perverted Sexual Practices,
10 years/$1000. Found not to apply to noncommercial, hetrosexual activity in
private. Schochet v. State, 1990.

MASSACHUSETTS
F 272-34, Crime Against Nature, 20 years. F 272-35, Unnatural and Lascivious
Acts, 5 years/$100-$1000. Crime Against Nature applies only to anal intercourse.
Unnatural and Lascivious Acts has been held not apply to private consensual
adult behavior. Commonwealth v. Balthazar, Supreme Judicial Court 1974. It has
been suggested that such a ruling would apply to Crime Against Nature.

MICHIGAN
F 750.158, Crime Against Nature, 15 years. Held unconstitutional as applied to
private, consensual adult behavior. Michigan Organization for Human Rights v.
Kelly (Wayne County Circ. Ct. 1990), no appeal taken, only applies to Wayne
County. Held consitutional by Michigan Court of Apeals (People v. Brashier)
1992, effective outside of Wayne County. Decision is needed from the Michigan
Supreme Court.

MINNESOTA
M 609.293, Sodomy, 1 year/$3000. Minnesota's law also prohibits sex between
humans and birds.

MISSISSIPPI
F 97-29-59, Unnatural Intercourse, 10 years

MISSOURI
M 566.090, Sexual Misconduct, 1 year/$1000, same sex only

MONTANA
F 45-5-505, Deviate Sexual Conduct, 10 years/$50,000, same sex only

NEBRASKA
Repealed effective 1978

NEVADA
Repealed effective 1993

NEW HAMPSHIRE
Repealed effective 1975

NEW JERSEY
Repealed effective 1979

NEW MEXICO
Repealed effective 1975

NEW YORK
Held unconstitutional by state Supreme Court 1980, People v. Onofre

NORTH CAROLINA
F 14-177, Crime Against Nature, 10 years / discretionary fine

NORTH DAKOTA
Repealed effective 1975

OHIO
Repealed effective 1974

OKLAHOMA
F 21-886, Crime Against Nature, 10 years. A 1977 effort to repeal sodomy laws
was met with a vote-delaying "chorus of giggles."

OREGON
Repealed effective 1972

PENNSYLVANIA
Held unconstitutional by state Supreme Court 1980. Commonwealth v. Bonadio

RHODE ISLAND
F 11-10-1, Crime Against Nature, 7-20 years. Includes "ordinary extramarital
intercourse." -- This was repealed in 1998.

SOUTH CAROLINA
F 16-15-120, Buggery, 5 years/$500. The law actually legislates the "abominable
crime of buggery." No further statutory explaination given.

SOUTH DAKOTA
Repealed effective 1977

TENNESSEE
M 39-13-510, Homosexual Acts, 30 days/$50, same sex only

TEXAS
Found unconstitutional by state Court of Appeals, England v. Dallas, no appeal
taken. Effective 1994 with the dismissal of Morales v. State.

UTAH
M 76-5-403, Sodomy, 6 months/$1000. In 1982, the Republican State Convention
added a plank to its platform stating that homosexuals should be denied the
civil, political, social, and economic rights guaranteed to others.

VERMONT
Repealed effective 1977

VIRGINIA
F 18.2-361, Crime Against Nature, 5-20 years

WASHINGTON
Repealed effective 1976

WEST VIRGINIA
Repealed effective 1976

WISCONSIN
Repealed effective 1983

WYOMING
Repealed effective 1977

D.C.
Repealed effective 1993

AMERICAN SAMOA
Repealed effective ?

GUAM
Repealed effective ?

N. MARIANA IS.
Repealed effective ?

VIRGIN ISLANDS
Repealed effective ?

PUERTO RICO
Criminal, penalties
Roedy Green
2005-01-16 07:06:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bill
for more up-to-date listings.
ALABAMA
M 13A-6-65,Sexual Misconduct, 1 year/$2000 Does not apply to married couples.
ALASKA
Repealed effective 1980
ARIZONA
even more up to date:

On 2003-11-18, the supreme court struck down the Texas anti-sodomy
law, so presumably any other states' would similarly crumble if
challenged.

http://www.cnn.com/2003/LAW/06/26/scotus.sodomy/


The way the supreme court works is whatever they say most recently
trumps everything before.


"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Roedy Green
2005-01-15 23:57:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bill
The main thing that you want is "accepted in society" To do that
you have to convert a lot of people to your way of life. Either that
or brainwash enough into thinking ab-normal behavior is normal
behavior.
It is impossible to "convert" people one way or the other.



"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Roedy Green
2005-01-14 22:50:42 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 20:13:05 GMT, Roedy Green
Post by Roedy Green
I find it peculiar that bigots, in the name of the prince of peace
spend most of their time attacking gay people.
Here is another anomaly. Republican bigots are very keen on war, yet
they protect their sons from participating with laws and dodges to
give them deferments.

But what is even more peculiar, is they extend that protection to the
people they claim to hate the most, the gays.


"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Dashiell Hammett
2005-01-14 22:53:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roedy Green
I find it peculiar that bigots, in the name of the prince of peace
spend most of their time attacking gay people.
Gays are the ones the army rejects as insufficiently bloodthirsty.
When was the last time you heard of a gay person beating up or
murdering someone?
http://www.tcjj.com/jessedirkhising/

http://www.crimelibrary.com/serial_killers/notorious/gacy/gacy_1.html

http://www.clickondetroit.com/news/2947705/detail.html

http://www.crimelibrary.com/serial_killers/predators/kraft/1.html

http://www.crimelibrary.com/serial_killers/predators/nilsen/stranger_1.html
Roedy Green
2005-01-14 23:19:54 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 17:53:58 -0500, "Dashiell Hammett"
Post by Roedy Green
When was the last time you heard of a gay person beating up or
murdering someone?
Men beating their wives are so common that it won't even make the
papers. There are shelters set up to deal with the problem it is so
common.

That simply does not happen with gay couples.

Think of a straight bar. Fights are common. They have special
employees called bouncers to deal with them. The equivalent in gay
establishments are simply to deal with NON-patrons hassling patrons.

Of course there are a few gay serial killers, just as they are
straight serial killers. It really does not make sense to extrapolate
the behaviour of these weirdoes when trying to figure out how average
gays and straights behave.


"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Dashiell Hammett
2005-01-15 01:36:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roedy Green
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 17:53:58 -0500, "Dashiell Hammett"
Men beating their wives are so common that it won't even make the
papers. There are shelters set up to deal with the problem it is so
common.
That simply does not happen with gay couples.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=10751048&dopt=Abstract

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/1997/10/06/MN61230.DTL

http://www.buddybuddy.com/ncavp97a.html

http://www.tampabaycoalition.com/files/108LesbianJudgeInvestigatedSpousalAbuse.htm

http://www.searchspaniel.com/index.php/Domestic_violence#Domestic_violence_in_homosexual_relationships
Roedy Green
2005-01-16 00:51:14 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 20:36:05 -0500, "Dashiell Hammett"
Post by Dashiell Hammett
Post by Roedy Green
That simply does not happen with gay couples.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=10751048&dopt=Abstract
This is a puzzle. This is in direct contradiction to my personal
observation. It is a .gov, so I can't dismiss it is right wing fringe
hate site.

Read carefully what you are quoting

"Using data from a nationally representative telephone survey that was
conducted from November 1995 to May 1996, this study compares lifetime
experiences with violent victimization among men and women with a
history of same-sex cohabitation and their counterparts with a history
of marriage and/or opposite-sex cohabitation only"


Same-sex cohabitation is a much broader category than same sex
couples. It even includes straight room-mates. Single straight males,
especially alcohol consumers, are the most violent of all.


"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
Dashiell Hammett
2005-01-16 15:56:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Roedy Green
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 20:36:05 -0500, "Dashiell Hammett"
Post by Dashiell Hammett
Post by Roedy Green
That simply does not happen with gay couples.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=10751048&dopt=Abstract
This is a puzzle. This is in direct contradiction to my personal
observation. It is a .gov, so I can't dismiss it is right wing fringe
hate site.
Read carefully what you are quoting
"Using data from a nationally representative telephone survey that was
conducted from November 1995 to May 1996, this study compares lifetime
experiences with violent victimization among men and women with a
history of same-sex cohabitation and their counterparts with a history
of marriage and/or opposite-sex cohabitation only"
Same-sex cohabitation is a much broader category than same sex
couples. It even includes straight room-mates. Single straight males,
especially alcohol consumers, are the most violent of all.
Possibly, but you left off the other cites I put in, which were specific
references to homosexual couples. One was even from a prominent San
Francisco newspaper and another from a gay site.
Roedy Green
2005-01-14 22:57:36 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 20:13:05 GMT, Roedy Green
Post by Roedy Green
I find it peculiar that bigots, in the name of the prince of peace
spend most of their time attacking gay people.
Here is another peculiarly in bigot logic.

If I tell a Republican bigot (I repeat myself), that Hitler forbade
Jews to marry, he has no problem seeing that Hitler was persecuting
the Jews.

If I suggest that Bush could enact a law to prevent Jews from marrying
other Jews, he would have no troubles seeing that as persecution of
Jews.

If I suggest that Bush could enact a law to prevent blacks from
marrying other blacks, he would have no trouble seeing that as
persecution of blacks.

Yet if I complain about Bush's constitutional amendment to prevent
gays from marrying other gays, suddenly new rules apply. This is just.
If gays were allowed to marry, it would be an EXTRA special privilege
not given to others. I can't for the life of me figure out what they
are talking about.


"Never in human history have such genocide and cruelty been witnessed.
Such a genocide was never seen in the time of the pharaohs nor of Hitler
nor of Mussolini."
~ Mehmet Elkatmi, head of Turkish parliament's human rights commission
on Bush's atrocities in the Iraq war.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
See http://mindprod.com/iraq.html photos of Bush's war crimes
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